Balancing the Balance

[aNoNiM]

Is there a way to limit the number of composters via plugin?

Like can't install more than 4 composters per player as an example?

Put the vanilla stack size on pickles or half the vanilla size etc. like limiting pickles to 10 per stack would be a lot of manual work to farm this.

 

 

[BRO]

8 hours ago, TiffDust said:

Hi @BRO Networth doesn't wipe, ever.
 

Think you found part of the problem right there.

[san]

11 hours ago, BRO said:

4. Consider PVE/PVP zones. Make more incentive to actually interact with the game. Some servers implement this by making Monuments PVP zones, or simply have random events that create a zone every X minutes/hours/etc in specified locations that is PVP-enabled. This could be anything from Gas Stations, Oil Rigs, or even Heli events. Get people out of their fucking bases because that's ridiculous.

Disagree here. I play on a PVE server specifically because I no longer care for PVP. I like that if I want to run a monument, I just go do it and I don't have to worry that somebody is going to be sitting in a corner waiting to shotgun me in the face. I feel like having PVP zones would alienate a significant number of people. 

[silver196543]

As i have played on most of the EZ servers at one time or another, pickle farming has been a way for me to get scrap in a faster rate, i have been playing for well over 1.5 years now, mostly on Scourge, when i first stated i was not keen to what was the best way to get scrap other than getting it from farming the roads for barrles and crates. I think it was a couple of months before i relized what PJ's were. I would have several bases all containing at least anywhere from 200 to 500 composters all together. Never gave much thought to networth other than a number. I would make a couple of farms  for hemp and berries also. I would normaly set a target of 50 to 60k of net worth a wipe for my self, then give any and all of my stuff away. Then start all over again at first of new wipe. I am currently at 1.2 million i think now. If the object is to get players to play more, rather than just logging on a couple hours per day, then it would seem to me that setting a limit to how many composters a player can have per wipe, i currently set my limit now to around 30 to 35, and then by mid wipe, i lose all intrest in them as far as scrap is concerned. Setting a limit on the size of bases, setting a limit of just 1 windturbine per base, and setting a limit of composters to 30 to 35 per player and setting a limit of 2 tc's per player would seem to me a way to cut back on lag and other issues caused by them. Some players may not have the time to stay online ecept in early morning before work or school, or others my just want to log on a little bit here and there. If the issue is stability of server or lag, setting a limit on the size of bases would seem to be a big start,,,, just a side note here, when are we gonna see EZ coffee mugs in the server store

[Sgttuggle]

I have been playing on Rustez servers for over a year now and on scourge I believe I have over 1 mil net worth and currently 700k on elysium I save the networth for the /shop for i like to buy decorations and such or I use it for revives or occasionally I will buy minis or other special /shop items and sell them in my in game shop I have only set up a pickle farm once with about 100 composters and I hated it for it was so tedious never did it again I usually have about 2-4 horses per wipe so me and my gf can go horseback riding around the map if we want but mainly like having help eat all the food we collected for it usually doesn't sell in the vending machines I make a farm that is 2 story but usually is a 6 by 8 or close to it with no windows and usually has a ladder hatch so we can get on the roof. always buy at least 1 test gen per wipe so never use wind turbines I love the servers, but I have seen the issue with pickle farms for some people take them as a challenge where they will have 500 composters one wipe and next wipe, they plan on increasing it to 1k composters which I have never understood, and I am hoping this stops people from doing this in the future

[Death]

The feedback so far has been incredibly useful and muchly appreciated. In the meantime we're working non-stop to find better alternatives to achieve what we're after. Regardless what happens we aren't perfect, and we won't always make the best decision. But what we always do is evaluate how our changes effect how you play and make adjustments accordingly.

At the end of the day our servers are for our players. We have to make the touch decision to change certain mechanics to balance the gameplay for your own benefit, even if you don't see it that way at first. If we make a terrible decision, we'll fix it and learn from the mistake.

[san]

Just now, Death said:

we'll fix it and learn from the mistake.

This is exactly what I told somebody in game last night. Stuff changes, it changes back, it's an evolving process. I'd encourage people to give this change the benefit of the doubt and don't immediately dip out to other servers.

 

I think it could also benefit the servers in another way. A slow down in scrap gain could lead to a higher server population further into wipe. We've all seen it plenty of times, the first week or so is very active, then interest starts to dwindle. Towards the end of wipe it's common to just see people hop on, do their quarries / pumpjacks / GE then hop off.

 

Slowing down AFK scrap gain could lead to more interaction between players at monuments and running the roads. Maybe we'll see people making trades for items instead of scrap. Trade a garage door for a couple electrical components or something.

[Lord McGuffin]

Wow, didn't realize some people played RustEZ like some sort of idle game on iPhone...

P.S.: Some of you really gotta start using paragraphs and punctuation. Hard to get your point across (or even taken seriously) if people have a hard time reading you or lose track halfway and skip the rest.

[a 3/0 sc lauan]

13 hours ago, Postanou said:

What about putting a cap on net worth? Like 500k or 1M and then anything above that is wasted? That way you don't have to tweak values/prices/composter rates.

It appears to me that too many players only grind to get that number as high as possible, and forget what net worth is actually meant for.

Waste of time buying and adding custom monuments to the servers when players only grind for net worth.

I love this tbh.  Net worth grind/obsession is one of the reasons i avoided the modded servers as a player, and i feel it takes away from the spirit of the community.  

[YokoHama]

Is there a way to limit composters to each player like i dunno each player who joins the server gets a max of 5 composters, if possible as well limit the amount of composters a player can have per base but but if you make a new base it still counts twords the limit. So 5 composters per person and make it so they're locked and that person can access the composter and 5 composters per base. 

[The Harv]

Why not use a resource cap for each player.  I believe there are apps available that set a limit on how much "build" a player can utilize per game.

[Death]

Putting a cap on how many composters you can place will have the same outcome as say making pickle farming redundant. Either way it kills the meta, but one adds a needless restriction and the other doesn't.

[Princess Angie]

11 hours ago, a 3/0 sc lauan said:

On 10/4/2022 at 1:39 PM, Postanou said:

What about putting a cap on net worth? Like 500k or 1M and then anything above that is wasted? That way you don't have to tweak values/prices/composter rates.

It appears to me that too many players only grind to get that number as high as possible, and forget what net worth is actually meant for.

Waste of time buying and adding custom monuments to the servers when players only grind for net worth.

I love this tbh.  Net worth grind/obsession is one of the reasons i avoided the modded servers as a player, and i feel it takes away from the spirit of the community.  

I'm probably one of the few people who can and willingly blow through 100-600k net worth a day or a wipe so this would hurt  

But I also don't pickle farm and have never done so - I did the last meta before the /shop was upgraded which was hemp > scrap > smokes > explosives, which still required a bit of farming  due to needing sulfur and charcoal. But I also won't lie that I've got a note-pad with all the /shop sell prices and the best way to get net worth to fund the gross obsession of APC/Apache signals that I throw down for myself, my team, or.. unsuspecting victims players, so we can all have a bit of fun.

[Postanou]

4 hours ago, Princess Angie said:

I'm probably one of the few people who can and willingly blow through 100-600k net worth a day or a wipe so this would hurt  

I never said anything about a 500k or 1M networth limit, just a cap. There's nothing stopping you from earning more networth IF under the cap. So if you spend lots, you can earn lots, just not stockpile millions upon millions that never get used.

Even if you do earn 600k per day in networth (doubt it), you can simply spend as you earn, and that would keep you under the cap.

[Thanatos Returns]

So much good feedback, some really good idea's that made sense to me.

It's hard to suggest things at times, because I'm of the opinion that if it floats your boat to farm massive Networth, is it really going to break the game for someone else? And if not, then hey, whatever makes you happy! Obviously lag can and does create a problem for individuals when they play (because of big farms), so really that should be addressed. Like someone else mentioned I also usually blow a bit of networth on a new wipe session.... so to me I like to have a nice safety net put away.

I've voted for the break even option, because of the lag concerns, and there are other ways to farm. Even my 16 plots for the occasional help rotation sets me up with a nice little top up of networth. But ultimately I like to use stone (pub quarry), HQM (pub quarry - halving output would still give me enough for my few builds plus some to put towards scrap for "costs"), and of course LGF (which I do a lot of mini flying with...but also the obvious Networth top ups every few real life days with a bulk sales).

In between running "the dailies", if I've got time to muck around, I like to farm crates or hit heli's and the APC as natural or signal spawns. I end up amassing a heap of components that even if I had a full time shop going - I'd still not run out of pipes, gears, tech trash, stop signs, gun bodies. And then there are the excess guns I try to give away occasionally or just end up scrapping. I hate to think of the calculations needed to balance such changes - but could I not sell excess custom SMGs, pistols, or ladder hatches to the /shop? Or my mass of sewing kits? Sure I can scrap them down... but wouldn't they be worth more to the shop as a whole product in a role-play sense? I'm wondering now if I actually have or haven't seen sewing kits as marketable  items ? 

I guess the analogy of a smorgasbord comes to mind. If you don't want everyone at a Chinese banquet to all focus on eating the honey chicken and avoiding the chicken chow-mein, then you better have some sweet and sour pork, special friend rice (edit: Oops, my secret is out), honey prawns, and rainbow beef available as well.... thanks for reading, hope you're all hungry now 

Edited October 6, 2022 by Thanatos Returns

[Joexezexs]

Hey I'm a net worth farmer it's why I moved from us pure to us scourge to kill zombies and become rich inflating a arbitrary number ( which I find hella fun )  but besides a few bobbles and trinkets to buy has no real purpose , that being said  I just wanted to share a few thoughts , windmills do cause a lot of lag and so do spot lights neither one is needed , you have a sleeping bag limit but you should have a TC limit ( that can reduce the space you can take up ) while I love the size of the server you could also make the server have a smaller population, and I have seen Death say that money is not a driving factor for them you could take some big item things and make them net worth only to by instead of cash you could balance the drive to scrap farm with the inflated cost of the items in net worth or maybe just make a farming server . Love the EZ crew but these changes are killing the fun.

P.S to death , I don't think you failed us I think we are enjoying the game in a way to didn't intend us to and are punishing us for it.

 

[Minty Mint]

Two other possibilities.  Feel free to point and laugh at them:

 

* Set pickle stacks back to vanilla (10 max per stack).  That would require pickle farmers to rotate stock every 50 minutes instead of every 500 minutes.

 

* Instanced vending machines at bandit / outpost.  Assuming this is even possible, it would allow per-player limits on not just pickles, but other items that devolve into "vending machine PVP".  For example, the stone vending machine at outpost.

 

[Princess Angie]

16 hours ago, Postanou said:

Even if you do earn 600k per day in networth (doubt it), you can simply spend as you earn, and that would keep you under the cap.

I don't think anyone can earn 600k networth a day, but I've never pickle farmed so if it is possible we might need a RustEZ support group or stage an intervention lmao 

 

 

[TiffDust]

When i think about the suggestions i've come up with or other peoples suggestions... it's surely going to more time consuming than changing a number (here and there) to break even. It takes time and focus away from all the fun stuff that's coming up.... no one wants that.  

[chugalug]

I do not understand these players with a goal of getting millions of networth and do nothing else. Since joining EZ I have not even hit 300k, My networth bounces all over the place due to TP's, respawns (thanks bradley) and the odd item from the store (christmas tree addiction problem, have to have a full set in at least one base)

I farm up enough comps, sulfer and metal to replace what I use during wipe so by next wipe I know I'm ready to go. i have a little extra so I'm covered for a wipe where IRL gets in the way and don't have the time to farm. Lets me jump on, go for a roam, do some monuments and log off.

You honestly don't need over 1M networth.

 

[Postanou]

3 hours ago, chugalug said:

I do not understand these players with a goal of getting millions of networth and do nothing else.

 

You & me both. Networth is only of value if you use it, not stockpile it. If you want to watch a number grow, go play Universal Paperclips.

https://www.decisionproblem.com/paperclips/index2.html

 

[JackTheGlorious]

I really support a hard nerf to farming. I loved my time on the server but the lag caused by the giant farms was depressing. I spent my last few wipes finding the most secluded area possible just so I could function at good framerates. It feels like there isn't a scrap economy after the first week once everybody gets farms down. Personally I would say that composters should just be capped at a low number. Just so that you could use them for making fertilizer for crop farms and a little bit of passive income. Its not like you even need that much money to buy anything.

 

[hc4stillo]

A reasonable solution is to move the fertilizer sale back to the vanilla format, so players need to spend more than 1 hour selling to get 1k scrap. (It is useless to have more than 6 horses or 50 composters) since selling the fertilizer is more complicated.

Death: The dynamic that Quest Room (plugin) brings by rewarding players for quests in the Outpost (opening hackable crates, destroying tanks, shooting down helicopters, killing heavy npc, zombies, etc.) would go a long way in promoting more activities to create thousands of entities.

[Mr.AFK]

pls add every type of raw meat can be sell to networth, this option can be change player to be another farming direction instead of pickle farm. it cause huge laggy !! 

[Death]

Taking all the feedback into account, pickle max stack has been reduced to 50 instead of 100. This is by no means final but I thought I'd try to find a compromise in the middle before making drastic changes. Your feedback is appreciated!