Community Poll - Enabling Upkeep for Pure

[Scotty]

I'm just glad the single twig foundations or barely started twig bases which are just abandoned and are all over the map will now quickly decay.  

[Orangella]

Yes, Please. The ridiculous builds with large amounts of unused space really affect the loading times causing severe lag even on high end pcs. I think this will help but I truly believe that implementing some build restrictions would end the issue completely. Best of luck slaying this monster.

[Le_Beholder]

I'll only accept this if you bring back personal quarries.

 

[Shrewd]

Hello guys, in case my name here is strange to you...Its Shrewd.
Well I do understand what each and every one of you is saying and i respect every opinion. Thank you Death for taking our opinions about this matter.  
Well, talking about my personal experience on this server, I guess it will affect me no doubt. Everyone in the Pure server knows that I build always for the community (western town, bandit camp, community places and so on...This is what I do...I build. So If upkeep will be implemented, I guess this will stop me from doing what I am good at. I don't know, it is just a personal opinion building it on a personal experience with the server. But of course, you do what is best for the server. Thank you for giving us the opportunity to say what we have to say.

[tribrats]

50 minutes ago, Santacruz said:

Hello guys, in case my name here is strange to you...Its Shrewd.
Well I do understand what each and every one of you is saying and i respect every opinion. Thank you Death for taking our opinions about this matter.  
Well, talking about my personal experience on this server, I guess it will affect me no doubt. Everyone in the Pure server knows that I build always for the community (western town, bandit camp, community places and so on...This is what I do...I build. So If upkeep will be implemented, I guess this will stop me from doing what I am good at. I don't know, it is just a personal opinion building it on a personal experience with the server. But of course, you do what is best for the server. Thank you for giving us the opportunity to say what we have to say.

In a case such as this, you could put up a drop box or a system with the pipes right to the tc and ask for donations to help with the upkeep. I know I'm willing to donate in such cases.

[Alba]

I see all points about this and I totally agree with what Ghoul and Shrewd have posted. We love this server since we started to play on it. At first I had a lot of bad experiencies with some guys in the server (about stealing, bad behaviours, etc) but now we love the server and also the community (I'm talking about EU Pure).
I can't think about living in a server without Aize's Church or the masterpiece buildings of Shrewd, NonZero, Orestes & Carmen, Nivs & Matt... ty guys!
Could be possible to have different decays on the same server? for instance, VIPS and subscribers will have unkeep system disabled and the rest of player enabled. Or about twig buildings have quickly decay as other mats.
Thank you Death for asking! (btw cats memes are the best memes in the world  )
 

[Lord McGuffin]

23 hours ago, tribrats said:

I've thought decay should be a thing for years. A higher decay rate for twig builds to encourage upgrading to help lessen the atrociously big builds. As well as to step away from the lag twig creates (I presume it still does disregard if that changed).

It is so easy to farm enough for upkeep.

The twig causing lag thing is a myth btw. Death answered this in a town hall a while back. If anything, armoured may cause somewhat more FPS drops than the other build skins, but twig, wood, stone, metal, it's all the same. So basically if there's gonna be decay, the only downside to twig bases is that they're ugly But obviously if there is decay then players will have to think before building, so less giant twig bases.

Also, we always have new players coming into wipe with a little too much "ambition", building huge twig structures all in one go (instead of starting small and building outwards over time), who inevitably get bored and don't come back. Right now those things just stick around for a week or more after wipe day, but with decay they'd be gone well before that.

 

[tribrats]

2 hours ago, Lord McGuffin said:

The twig causing lag thing is a myth btw. Death answered this in a town hall a while back. If anything, armoured may cause somewhat more FPS drops than the other build skins, but twig, wood, stone, metal, it's all the same. So basically if there's gonna be decay, the only downside to twig bases is that they're ugly But obviously if there is decay then players will have to think before building, so less giant twig bases.

Also, we always have new players coming into wipe with a little too much "ambition", building huge twig structures all in one go (instead of starting small and building outwards over time), who inevitably get bored and don't come back. Right now those things just stick around for a week or more after wipe day, but with decay they'd be gone well before that.

 

Oh, believe me, I know how ugly twig is and how huge people can build. Saw a lot of it back when I was an admin. Wish we could have had decay at least on twig back then but it didn't fit with the goals of the server (understandably). Even if there's no decay on the other mats, I'd still love to see twig decay.

[Lord McGuffin]

[Death]

If upkeep is implemented, it will be below vanilla, likely what our Scourge servers used to be, which was 70%. So the cost would not be as much as you'd expect. Also, if we do decide to implement upkeep, it wouldn't be something we'd do overnight. There would be, at minimum, a month's heads up in advance.

[Sh0gunMast3r]

On 5/26/2023 at 2:17 PM, Fly said:

well. from my perspective as a staff member on pure i would love to see lage twig structures go faster. but from a player perspective i have to join ghouls statement above.

isnt it possible you add   like (double?)decay on twig and un-tc-ed structures, but as soon i upgrade to stones reduce the upkeep so you dont have to farm upkeep as a chore?

Totally agree

[MrSnuggle]

1 hour ago, Death said:

If upkeep is implemented, it will be below vanilla, likely what our Scourge servers used to be, which was 70%. So the cost would not be as much as you'd expect. Also, if we do decide to implement upkeep, it wouldn't be something we'd do overnight. There would be, at minimum, a month's heads up in advance.

I think finding the right upkeep balance would be the hardest thing to do. Like others said, i do not have a lot of time to play during a wipe (been really busy lately) and my base is kept up by regularly login. I do that so when i can play in the weekend, i'm able to continue and not start over each day..

 

We'd just have to find a nice balance.

[Oxygen.]

How long will this poll run for? Because some people never look at discord or have it so if it's more worth it for you and the community as a whole to get as many votes as possible, not sure if a server comment can be added for pure servers at the start of wipe for the first couple of days with the link to this forum post to ask people for more opinions/votes if you need more opinions

[BigDave]

I don't have a problem with adding decay on Pure.

I play equally on AUPure, AUScourge, AUSurvival and USElysium. Half of those have decay already and I don't have a problem keeping up with the decay on Scourge and Elysium.

I would say I'm casual since I work full-time and have  a young child, I've not experienced a time issue personally.

Pure doesn't have networth to collect so it's not like those resources are required in large quantities elsewhere. Stone trade for wood hasn't been as important recently given electric furnaces, so I always have excess stone on pure. Even the 1.8K of HQM from 1 full tank of LGF in the quarry once a day gives you a pretty big base. Add in 15k stone and 3k metal, you could maintain a decent sized mixed composition base.

Now with pipes and a conveyer set to Max of x days supply you should be sweet to set and forget with just filling boxes from quarries once a day.

I honestly don't care either way though, I enjoy the servers as they are currently.

I wouldn't want to add anything that causes a negative experience for a reasonable amount of others so I guess that's an important consideration.

Cheers,

Dave

[Sugar Daddy]

I find the bias against big builds strange in this thread. Why is building in a game where building is fun such a bad thing? If the bias is because of lag, I don't understand not mentioning lasers and wind turbines which REALLY cause lag. How big is too big, not discussed at all? Maybe establishing that would help to gain perspective. Such mixed message here. We wanna be more like "pure vanilla" but we allow store purchases, instanced loot, quarries and pumpjacks, non spawning of cars, boats and horses and for VIPs virtual recycler and daily drops....etc. I think the community really loves all of this yet the motive for this poll  is stated to become more NOT like this? So I'm pretty unclear what this is all about. Is RustEZ going to be phasing all of this out.......or.......? I'm very confused. I did look for other non decay servers being sad about the whole thing. Finding nothing appealing, I'm now streaming Fringe instead of playing. Maybe more vision, more explanation that makes sense will help ease my mind.

Edited May 30, 2023 by KR6SSY

[Net-Viper X]

I run a very large vendor mall and that is my main focus and enjoyment when playing. This requires a large base to house all the storage for materials, the pumpjack, farms, refineries and all that. The grind to sustain this is massive already, having to add another grind just to keep my base from vanishing would be a huge blow to my enjoyment and likely be the end of The Viper Pit vendor mall.

[Net-Viper X]

25 minutes ago, RKF1 said:

My opinion is that there are plenty of "vendor malls" already. The admins build them...every wipe. There is also bandit, outpost and other people who have vending machines. Just scale it down. Big builds are the sole reason I voted for upkeep, and it should be at full vanilla levels, not part way.

I have been making that mall for over a year, its the main reason I play and the number of customers I get makes it clear my store is well liked by players. It's not possible to scale it down with the mess that is trying to sell skinned items. If they would make it so you could sell one pair of pants and the buyer could choose which of my skins the pants had that would allow me to reduce the number of machines quite a bit, as is i need all those machines. Even so the amount of crafting materials it takes to keep everything stocked still takes a huge amount of time to gather and room to store it. Having to spend hours a day grinding resources just to keep my base up is an added burden I simply don't have time for and won't enjoy, and if I come up short one day or happen to miss a few days for whatever reason its all gone.

[Sugar Daddy]

On 5/27/2023 at 6:19 AM, Santacruz said:

Hello guys, in case my name here is strange to you...Its Shrewd.
Well I do understand what each and every one of you is saying and i respect every opinion. Thank you Death for taking our opinions about this matter.  
Well, talking about my personal experience on this server, I guess it will affect me no doubt. Everyone in the Pure server knows that I build always for the community (western town, bandit camp, community places and so on...This is what I do...I build. So If upkeep will be implemented, I guess this will stop me from doing what I am good at. I don't know, it is just a personal opinion building it on a personal experience with the server. But of course, you do what is best for the server. Thank you for giving us the opportunity to say what we have to say.

I agree, I build a "Brad Pad" for players to take down Bradley and also multiple community towers for those who like to fight Karen. This is what I do  I don't think I can count on donations especially since others will be needing to upkeep their own bases. I love seeing the larger prettier and imaginative builds which is why I gravitated to Pure. Every time I see someone mention lag it's about builds and never about turbines, lasers, music etc. I love the community builds and it would be sad to see them go, especially our "wipe end build" MooViper makes for us. How will community builds be handled? Donations? I think that will be a bust and too much of a hardship on those who want to make a better community!

 

[Sugar Daddy]

1 hour ago, RKF1 said:

My opinion is that there are plenty of "vendor malls" already. The admins build them...every wipe. There is also bandit, outpost and other people who have vending machines. Just scale it down. Big builds are the sole reason I voted for upkeep, and it should be at full vanilla levels, not part way.

So then only admins are supposed to have the fun building vendor malls.........then what is the point!

[xNatti]

Ok so I haven't been on Pure for a few wipes (trying out Scourge and now Elysium), but since I spent a part of 2021 and almost all of 2022 there I'm going to add my view to this.

While I admit that loosing my base and stuff because I was careless with upkeep sucks, it hasn't been that much of an issue.
Sure it's different because of stacking, but the idea of a vanilla "versus Environment" includes decay in my mind.
(The 7 day removal affects me more, b/c sometimes I need to be away for 8-9 days due to work, and that ruins the whole wipe for me, I can't plan for that, but I can plan for upkeep.)

Having upkeep means that in many cases people will be more conscious about how they build their base, optimization, engineering and design starts to matter.
And for that reason upkeep gets my vote.

(Not having spawned boats and horses, and the miniature range of launch site sams, isn't vanilla either, but hopefully we'll get there someday.)

 

On 5/27/2023 at 1:19 PM, Santacruz said:

Hello guys, in case my name here is strange to you...Its Shrewd.
Well I do understand what each and every one of you is saying and i respect every opinion. Thank you Death for taking our opinions about this matter.  
Well, talking about my personal experience on this server, I guess it will affect me no doubt. Everyone in the Pure server knows that I build always for the community (western town, bandit camp, community places and so on...This is what I do...I build. So If upkeep will be implemented, I guess this will stop me from doing what I am good at. I don't know, it is just a personal opinion building it on a personal experience with the server. But of course, you do what is best for the server. Thank you for giving us the opportunity to say what we have to say.

 

14 minutes ago, KR6SSY said:

I agree, I build a "Brad Pad" for players to take down Bradley and also multiple community towers for those who like to fight Karen. This is what I do  I don't think I can count on donations especially since others will be needing to upkeep their own bases. I love seeing the larger prettier and imaginative builds which is why I gravitated to Pure. Every time I see someone mention lag it's about builds and never about turbines, lasers, music etc. I love the community builds and it would be sad to see them go, especially our "wipe end build" MooViper makes for us. How will community builds be handled? Donations? I think that will be a bust and too much of a hardship on those who want to make a better community!

 

 

Now, the Western Town(s) is what I thought of first when I read the poll.

But I think having the *community* participate in building material and upkeep for certain projects isn't  necessarily a bad thing.
It might as well bring the "community" part closer together.
Because let's face it, a number of the "community" builds are still just solo builds, and players outside of the friends-circle of the creator stay away except for occasional fly-over to view the masterpiece.

And I'm not going to miss yet-another abandoned/empty "community hotel".

[Scotty]

As i understand it,   with the industrial system, you can link many boxes to your TC to auto feed it, and with quarries, in the first week of play you can have your base's upkeep for the rest of the wipe taken care of. So I don't think this changes too much for the die-hards, just adds a little extra effort. But what this WILL do is clear out all the started twig crap that is not used, and get rid of a lot of small abandoned bases from one timers. That is a huge QOL update for all of us. IMO this is a good thing.

[Annoyed Grunt]

WIll add my 2 cents again here.

Adding upkeep on a server is never gonna please everyone - You lose or gain players. But the fact remains that the situation with the rules was not fixed, People that have 10 - 20 floodings, 50 lasers and windmills cause a huge amount of lag - I said this many months ago on the feedback but nothing gets done.

By adding upkeep your claiming it will add a "vanilla" aspect to the game but still have /vip /rec, personal loot and the online shop. If the argument is "vanilla" its still not really "vanilla".

 

[Sugar Daddy]

14 hours ago, RKF1 said:

Big builds have lots of entities and create lag. Lasers and wind turbines don't cause lag on their own, it's all about how many items you have. Like 24 large planters full of plants for example, with lights, and sprinklers, water catchers, that is a ton of entities, just with farming. Then you add a place for friends...who have their own builds.... and it just keeps getting bigger and bigger. If they decide to add upkeep, then you either build smaller or become a farmer of metal and rock. I think it's a great change. Vip, the store, and the perks that go with it are just a way to support the server, I don't see a problem with that. But the random player should come in to a full true Rust experience with the exception of pvp and building damage off. This is of course my opinion.

Some of us don't enjoy the toxic antagonistic "true Rust experience" which is why they've come to this server. There's nothing wrong with building community areas so new people can LEARN how to take Brad and Karen instead of hiding from them. I for one love teaching noobs how to fight the big guys and the new fighters are so grateful to learn.. People have their own way of playing on this server and to force one to become a farmer of metal and rock shouldn't be one of them, IMO. And I completely disagree that lots of turbines combined with lasers and music don't cause lag.  

[Sentinell]

As someone who has put in a staggering amount of hours of gameplay on US Pure and EU Pure, I've long considered that adding decay would be beneficial to the server, even before the pipes. Now that we have industrial automation, I think those who are able to handle the basics of it will hardly see a change. I build some pretty large bases from time to time, and I've had the chance to sample (current) Scourge decay on my long vacation there as of recently. I've also built one or two mega structures on Elysium in the early wipes on that server (my much loved HQM tower on the ice lake the very first wipe). Even for bases of the size I build, I can with four or five ore teas spend three hours *total* farming materials to keep the TC filled. That's at least true for the 25x7 adobe factory I built for my friends and team this wipe. Granted, I've built larger, but I think the big issue with no decay is that building mega size doesn't require much of an investment. Thus, we see lone twig foundations polluting the wilderness, mega twig towers that are immediately abandoned racking up minicopter kills on the daily, and various other general eyesores. I know that decay will force some people to learn a bit more electrics and industrialization than they would like, but in my experience sampling decay servers it hasn't slowed me down too much. Forcing mega builds to have a modest time investment to not be temporary does not seem like a big ask, and while I think for some people there will be growing pains, it will help stimulate community interaction and trade which for me has always been the big appeal of RustEZ servers and especially Pure.

[Deathmated]

On 5/30/2023 at 6:03 PM, Net-Viper X said:

I run a very large vendor mall and that is my main focus and enjoyment when playing. This requires a large base to house all the storage for materials, the pumpjack, farms, refineries and all that. The grind to sustain this is massive already, having to add another grind just to keep my base from vanishing would be a huge blow to my enjoyment and likely be the end of The Viper Pit vendor mall.

The decay can be 200 percent more than normal and you will be fine Viper. I play on other servers where decay is normal. 24k metal shards, or 5k to 8k HQM a day is easy to come by on RUSTEZ, and on other servers where decay is normal. I build 21 by 20 massive buildings with 420 vending machines and I can keep up the decay by myself. That is why I think it is pointless to discuss it at all unless advanced changes are made overall.

Edited June 1, 2023 by Deathmated